How did the debate go?

geez.. his birth certificate is not in question.. he was born in hawaii. period. seriously.. fact check is your friend. :laughing:

http://www.fact check.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
Born in the U.S.A.
August 21, 2008
Updated: August 26, 2008
The truth about Obama's birth certificate.
Summary
In June, the Obama campaign released a digitally scanned image of his birth certificate to quell speculative charges that he might not be a natural-born citizen. But the image prompted more blog-based skepticism about the document's authenticity. And recently, author Jerome Corsi, whose book attacks Obama, said in a TV interview that the birth certificate the campaign has is "fake."

We beg to differ. FactCheck.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate. We conclude that it meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false. We have posted high-resolution photographs of the document as "supporting documents" to this article. Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said.
Analysis
Since we first wrote about Obama's birth certificate on June 16, speculation on his citizenship has continued apace. Some claim that Obama posted a fake birth certificate to his Web page. That charge leaped from the blogosphere to the mainstream media earlier this week when Jerome Corsi, author of a book attacking Obama, repeated the claim in an Aug. 15 interview with Steve Doocy on Fox News.

Corsi: Well, what would be really helpful is if Senator Obama would release primary documents like his birth certificate. The campaign has a false, fake birth certificate posted on their website. How is anybody supposed to really piece together his life?

Doocy: What do you mean they have a "false birth certificate" on their Web site?

Corsi: The original birth certificate of Obama has never been released, and the campaign refuses to release it.

Doocy: Well, couldn't it just be a State of Hawaii-produced duplicate?

Corsi: No, it's a -- there's been good analysis of it on the Internet, and it's been shown to have watermarks from Photoshop. It's a fake document that's on the Web site right now, and the original birth certificate the campaign refuses to produce.

Corsi isn't the only skeptic claiming that the document is a forgery. Among the most frequent objections we saw on forums, blogs and e-mails are:

* The birth certificate doesn't have a raised seal.
* It isn't signed.
* No creases from folding are evident in the scanned version.
* In the zoomed-in view, there's a strange halo around the letters.
* The certificate number is blacked out.
* The date bleeding through from the back seems to say "2007," but the document wasn't released until 2008.
* The document is a "certification of birth," not a "certificate of birth."

Recently FactCheck representatives got a chance to spend some time with the birth certificate, and we can attest to the fact that it is real and three-dimensional and resides at the Obama headquarters in Chicago. We can assure readers that the certificate does bear a raised seal, and that it's stamped on the back by Hawaii state registrar Alvin T. Onaka (who uses a signature stamp rather than signing individual birth certificates). We even brought home a few photographs.


The Obama birth certificate, held by FactCheck writer Joe Miller


Alvin T. Onaka's signature stamp


The raised seal


Blowup of text

You can click on the photos to get full-size versions, which haven't been edited in any way, except that some have been rotated 90 degrees for viewing purposes.

The certificate has all the elements the State Department requires for proving citizenship to obtain a U.S. passport: "your full name, the full name of your parent(s), date and place of birth, sex, date the birth record was filed, and the seal or other certification of the official custodian of such records." The names, date and place of birth, and filing date are all evident on the scanned version, and you can see the seal above.

The document is a "certification of birth," also known as a short-form birth certificate. The long form is drawn up by the hospital and includes additional information such as birth weight and parents' hometowns. The short form is printed by the state and draws from a database with fewer details. The Hawaii Department of Health's birth record request form does not give the option to request a photocopy of your long-form birth certificate, but their short form has enough information to be acceptable to the State Department. We tried to ask the Hawaii DOH why they only offer the short form, among other questions, but they have not given a response.

The scan released by the campaign shows halos around the black text, making it look (to some) as though the text might have been pasted on top of an image of security paper. But the document itself has no such halos, nor do the close-up photos we took of it. We conclude that the halo seen in the image produced by the campaign is a digital artifact from the scanning process.

We asked the Obama campaign about the date stamp and the blacked-out certificate number. The certificate is stamped June 2007, because that's when Hawaii officials produced it for the campaign, which requested that document and "all the records we could get our hands on" according to spokesperson Shauna Daly. The campaign didn't release its copy until 2008, after speculation began to appear on the Internet questioning Obama's citizenship. The campaign then rushed to release the document, and the rush is responsible for the blacked-out certificate number. Says Shauna: "[We] couldn't get someone on the phone in Hawaii to tell us whether the number represented some secret information, and we erred on the side of blacking it out. Since then we've found out it's pretty irrelevant for the outside world." The document we looked at did have a certificate number; it is 151 1961 - 010641.


Blowup of certificate number

Some of the conspiracy theories that have circulated about Obama are quite imaginative. One conservative blogger suggested that the campaign might have obtained a valid Hawaii birth certificate, soaked it in solvent, then reprinted it with Obama's information. Of course, this anonymous blogger didn't have access to the actual document and presents this as just one possible "scenario" without any evidence that such a thing actually happened or is even feasible.

We also note that so far none of those questioning the authenticity of the document have produced a shred of evidence that the information on it is incorrect. Instead, some speculate that somehow, maybe, he was born in another country and doesn't meet the Constitution's requirement that the president be a "natural-born citizen."

We think our colleagues at PolitiFact.com, who also dug into some of these loopy theories put it pretty well: "It is possible that Obama conspired his way to the precipice of the world’s biggest job, involving a vast network of people and government agencies over decades of lies. Anything’s possible. But step back and look at the overwhelming evidence to the contrary and your sense of what’s reasonable has to take over."

In fact, the conspiracy would need to be even deeper than our colleagues realized. In late July, a researcher looking to dig up dirt on Obama instead found a birth announcement that had been published in the Honolulu Advertiser on Sunday, Aug. 13, 1961:


Obama's birth announcement


The announcement was posted by a pro-Hillary Clinton blogger who grudgingly concluded that Obama "likely" was born Aug. 4, 1961 in Honolulu.
Of course, it's distantly possible that Obama's grandparents may have planted the announcement just in case their grandson needed to prove his U.S. citizenship in order to run for president someday. We suggest that those who choose to go down that path should first equip themselves with a high-quality tinfoil hat. The evidence is clear: Barack Obama was born in the U.S.A.

Update, August 26: We received responses to some of our questions from the Hawaii Department of Health. They couldn't tell us anything about their security paper, but they did answer another frequently-raised question: why is Obama's father's race listed as "African"? Kurt Tsue at the DOH told us that father's race and mother's race are supplied by the parents, and that "we accept what the parents self identify themselves to be." We consider it reasonable to believe that Barack Obama, Sr., would have thought of and reported himself as "African." It's certainly not the slam dunk some readers have made it out to be.

When we asked about the security borders, which look different from some other examples of Hawaii certifications of live birth, Kurt said "The borders are generated each time a certified copy is printed. A citation located on the bottom left hand corner of the certificate indicates which date the form was revised." He also confirmed that the information in the short form birth certificate is sufficient to prove citizenship for "all reasonable purposes."

–by Jess Henig, with Joe Miller

more people just trying to disparage this man instead of focusing on the issues.
 
3mnkids1 said:
geez.. his birth certificate is not in question.. he was born in hawaii. period. seriously.. fact check is your friend. :laughing:

http://www.fact check.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
Born in the U.S.A.
August 21, 2008
Updated: August 26, 2008
The truth about Obama's birth certificate.
Summary
In June, the Obama campaign released a digitally scanned image of his birth certificate to quell speculative charges that he might not be a natural-born citizen. But the image prompted more blog-based skepticism about the document's authenticity. And recently, author Jerome Corsi, whose book attacks Obama, said in a TV interview that the birth certificate the campaign has is "fake."

We beg to differ. hug.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate. We conclude that it meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false. We have posted high-resolution photographs of the document as "supporting documents" to this article. Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said.
Analysis
Since we first wrote about Obama's birth certificate on June 16, speculation on his citizenship has continued apace. Some claim that Obama posted a fake birth certificate to his Web page. That charge leaped from the blogosphere to the mainstream media earlier this week when Jerome Corsi, author of a book attacking Obama, repeated the claim in an Aug. 15 interview with Steve Doocy on Fox News.

Corsi: Well, what would be really helpful is if Senator Obama would release primary documents like his birth certificate. The campaign has a false, fake birth certificate posted on their website. How is anybody supposed to really piece together his life?

Doocy: What do you mean they have a "false birth certificate" on their Web site?

Corsi: The original birth certificate of Obama has never been released, and the campaign refuses to release it.

Doocy: Well, couldn't it just be a State of Hawaii-produced duplicate?

Corsi: No, it's a -- there's been good analysis of it on the Internet, and it's been shown to have watermarks from Photoshop. It's a fake document that's on the Web site right now, and the original birth certificate the campaign refuses to produce.

Corsi isn't the only skeptic claiming that the document is a forgery. Among the most frequent objections we saw on forums, blogs and e-mails are:

* The birth certificate doesn't have a raised seal.
* It isn't signed.
* No creases from folding are evident in the scanned version.
* In the zoomed-in view, there's a strange halo around the letters.
* The certificate number is blacked out.
* The date bleeding through from the back seems to say "2007," but the document wasn't released until 2008.
* The document is a "certification of birth," not a "certificate of birth."

Recently hug representatives got a chance to spend some time with the birth certificate, and we can attest to the fact that it is real and three-dimensional and resides at the Obama headquarters in Chicago. We can assure readers that the certificate does bear a raised seal, and that it's stamped on the back by Hawaii state registrar Alvin T. Onaka (who uses a signature stamp rather than signing individual birth certificates). We even brought home a few photographs.


The Obama birth certificate, held by hug writer Joe Miller


Alvin T. Onaka's signature stamp


The raised seal


Blowup of text

You can click on the photos to get full-size versions, which haven't been edited in any way, except that some have been rotated 90 degrees for viewing purposes.

The certificate has all the elements the State Department requires for proving citizenship to obtain a U.S. passport: "your full name, the full name of your parent(s), date and place of birth, sex, date the birth record was filed, and the seal or other certification of the official custodian of such records." The names, date and place of birth, and filing date are all evident on the scanned version, and you can see the seal above.

The document is a "certification of birth," also known as a short-form birth certificate. The long form is drawn up by the hospital and includes additional information such as birth weight and parents' hometowns. The short form is printed by the state and draws from a database with fewer details. The Hawaii Department of Health's birth record request form does not give the option to request a photocopy of your long-form birth certificate, but their short form has enough information to be acceptable to the State Department. We tried to ask the Hawaii DOH why they only offer the short form, among other questions, but they have not given a response.

The scan released by the campaign shows halos around the black text, making it look (to some) as though the text might have been pasted on top of an image of security paper. But the document itself has no such halos, nor do the close-up photos we took of it. We conclude that the halo seen in the image produced by the campaign is a digital artifact from the scanning process.

We asked the Obama campaign about the date stamp and the blacked-out certificate number. The certificate is stamped June 2007, because that's when Hawaii officials produced it for the campaign, which requested that document and "all the records we could get our hands on" according to spokesperson Shauna Daly. The campaign didn't release its copy until 2008, after speculation began to appear on the Internet questioning Obama's citizenship. The campaign then rushed to release the document, and the rush is responsible for the blacked-out certificate number. Says Shauna: "[We] couldn't get someone on the phone in Hawaii to tell us whether the number represented some secret information, and we erred on the side of blacking it out. Since then we've found out it's pretty irrelevant for the outside world." The document we looked at did have a certificate number; it is 151 1961 - 010641.


Blowup of certificate number

Some of the conspiracy theories that have circulated about Obama are quite imaginative. One conservative blogger suggested that the campaign might have obtained a valid Hawaii birth certificate, soaked it in solvent, then reprinted it with Obama's information. Of course, this anonymous blogger didn't have access to the actual document and presents this as just one possible "scenario" without any evidence that such a thing actually happened or is even feasible.

We also note that so far none of those questioning the authenticity of the document have produced a shred of evidence that the information on it is incorrect. Instead, some speculate that somehow, maybe, he was born in another country and doesn't meet the Constitution's requirement that the president be a "natural-born citizen."

We think our colleagues at PolitiFact.com, who also dug into some of these loopy theories put it pretty well: "It is possible that Obama conspired his way to the precipice of the world’s biggest job, involving a vast network of people and government agencies over decades of lies. Anything’s possible. But step back and look at the overwhelming evidence to the contrary and your sense of what’s reasonable has to take over."

In fact, the conspiracy would need to be even deeper than our colleagues realized. In late July, a researcher looking to dig up dirt on Obama instead found a birth announcement that had been published in the Honolulu Advertiser on Sunday, Aug. 13, 1961:


Obama's birth announcement


The announcement was posted by a pro-Hillary Clinton blogger who grudgingly concluded that Obama "likely" was born Aug. 4, 1961 in Honolulu.
Of course, it's distantly possible that Obama's grandparents may have planted the announcement just in case their grandson needed to prove his U.S. citizenship in order to run for president someday. We suggest that those who choose to go down that path should first equip themselves with a high-quality tinfoil hat. The evidence is clear: Barack Obama was born in the U.S.A.

Update, August 26: We received responses to some of our questions from the Hawaii Department of Health. They couldn't tell us anything about their security paper, but they did answer another frequently-raised question: why is Obama's father's race listed as "African"? Kurt Tsue at the DOH told us that father's race and mother's race are supplied by the parents, and that "we accept what the parents self identify themselves to be." We consider it reasonable to believe that Barack Obama, Sr., would have thought of and reported himself as "African." It's certainly not the slam dunk some readers have made it out to be.

When we asked about the security borders, which look different from some other examples of Hawaii certifications of live birth, Kurt said "The borders are generated each time a certified copy is printed. A citation located on the bottom left hand corner of the certificate indicates which date the form was revised." He also confirmed that the information in the short form birth certificate is sufficient to prove citizenship for "all reasonable purposes."

–by Jess Henig, with Joe Miller

more people just trying to disparage this man instead of focusing on the issues.
Click to expand...


Yeah, I think that was in question like 6 months ago(if not more) and has been more than cleared up :laughing: He's an american and does NOT have dual citizenship either. Be sure to bookmark those unbiased, f a c t-checking sites, people! :wave:
 
Oh I just couldn't resist answering you ladies wrong his birth certificate is still in question. I 'll post the info tomorrow but it's going to be interesting to see if the judge forces him to release his papers. Really ya'll just can't believe everything you read.

Is the problem that I don't support Obama so I can't have an opinion? I guess that must be it.

JUDGE ORDERS OBAMA TO PRODUCE BIRTH CERTIFICATE

By Jon Christian Dryer

October 3, 2008

NewsWithViews.com

On September 29, 2008 US District Court Judge R. Barclay Surrick, the federal magistrate for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania ruled in the matter of Philip J. Berg vs Barack Hussein Obama, et al as the world was distracted by the $700 billion subprime mortgage crisis. Obama signed a breathe of relief as the mainstream media chose to ignore the question: "Can Senator Barack Hussein Obama legally seek the office of President of the United States?"

The flap began in June when National Review's Jim Geraghty raised the question and asked the Obama Campaign to release a copy of his birth certificate in order to prove that he actually was born in the United States. (Reports had previously surfaced claiming that Obama's Kenyan grandmother, Sarah Hussein Obama, told reporters that Obama was not born in Hawaii, but in Kenya. She reportedly told reporters that when her son, Barack Hussein Obama, Sr. returned to Kenya he was accompanied by a pregnant white wife who was close to term.)

Obama's family did not take to Stanley Ann Dunham Obama well according to Sarah Obama because she was white. Shortly after she arrived in Kenya Stanley Ann decided to return to Hawaii because she did not like how Muslim men treated their wives in Kenya. However, because she was near term the airline would not let her fly until after the birth of her baby. Obama's grandmother said the baby was born in Kenya and that shortly after Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. was born, Stanley Ann returned to Hawaii.

Purportedly, when she arrived back in Hawaii, Stanley Anne registered her son's live birth as an event which had just happened—in Hawaii. This supposition is based on the appearance, shortly after Nov. 6, 2007, of a Hawaiian birth certificate that was issued, as a duplicate birth certificate, by the State of Hawaii to a US Senator who requested it.

While the Internet screamed that the birth certificate, which appeared on the Obama Campaign's "Fight The Smears" website and was also downloaded and used by far left blogger Markos Zuniga on his website, Daily Kos, it was not an electronic image concocted by Daily KOs as was hypothesized by a self-described cyvbersleuth who uses the cyber pseudonym Techdude. It was the real McCoy—even if it was issued as a political favor to a prospective Democratic presidential candidate by a Democrat official in Hawaii. The county clerk who issued the document, which purports to be a copy of an original document, was date stamped "Nov. 6, 2007" on the reverse side of the birth certificate in blue ink which bled through and is visible on the front of the electronic image.

Attorney Philip J. Berg, the former head of the Montgomery County. Pennsylvania Democratic Party and a former member of the Democratic State Convention and, reportedly a Hillary Clinton supporter, wanted to learn the truth from the myriad of rumors that also suggested that Sen. Obama may also have been a citizen of Indonesia. The only consistent part of the story was Stanley Ann returning to Hawaii to claim he had been in the United States and was a US citizen. In his ruling, Judge Surrick noted that the "...cause came before the United States District Court Judge, Honorable R. Barclay Surrick on defendant Barack Hussein Obama and the Democratic National Committee's motion to dismiss." The order continued, "Having reviewed the motion and plaintiff's opposition to said motion and for good cause shown, it is hereby ordered that the motion to dismiss pursuant to F.R.C.P. 12(b)(1) and 12(b)(6) is denied. It is further order of this court that the following discovery is to be turned over to plaintiff within three (3) days.

1. Obama's "vault" version (certified copy of his "original" long version) birth certificate; and
2. a certified copy of Obama's Certificate of Citizenship;
3. a certified copy of Obama's oath of allegiance."

In his original filing, Berg specifically asked for those three items. Berg told the court that "...at the time Plaintiff's complaint was filed, Plaintiff was requesting protections from the court in order to stop Obama from being nominated by the DNC as the Democratic Presidential Nominee as Obama is not eligible to serve as President of the United States. However, Obama was nominated by the DNC...For that reason, Plaintiff must amend his complaint and will be amending this complaint to file a First Amendment complaint...."

Berg argued that he felt it was the role of the Federal Election Commission to ensure that presidential and congressional candidates are eligible to hold the positions for which they were seeking, and that those candidates run a fair and legitimate campaign. "In vetting the presidential candidate," Berg argued, "the DNC and the FEC are required to ensure the eligibility requirements pursuant to our Constitution are met and the Presidential nominee, if elected, is qualified and eligible to serve pursuant to our United States Constitution. In order to be eligible to run for the Office of President of the United States, you must be a "natural born" citizen.

"There appears to be no question that Defendant Obama's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, was a US citizen. It is also undisputed, however, that his father, Barack Obama, Sr., was a citizen of Kenya. Obama's parents, according to divorce recorded, were married on or about February 2, 1961."

"Defendant Obama claims he was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. on August 4, 1961 and it is uncertain in which hospital he claims to have been born. Obama's grandmother on his father's side, his half-brother and half-sister all claim Obama was born not in Hawaii but in Kenya. Reports reflect that Obama's mother traveled to Kenya during her pregnancy; however, she was prevented from boarding a flight from Kenya to Hawaii. at her late stage of pregnancy (which apparently are normal restrictions, to avoid births during flights). By these reports, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama gave birth to Obama in Kenya, after which she flew home and registered Obama's birth. There are records of a "registry of birth" for Obama, on or about August 8, 1961 in the public records office in Hawaii."

Berg's investigators revealed that Obama's own half-sister Maya Soetoro—with whom he was raised—seemed not to know where her own brother was born. In the Nov., 2004 interview by the Rainbow Newsletter Maya Soetoro said Obama was born on Aug. 4, 1961 at Queens Medical Center in Honolulu, Hawaii. In February, 2008 Maya was interviewed by the Star Bulletin. This time she told reporters that Obama was born on August 4, 1961 at the Kaliolani Medical Center for Women and Children. On June 9, 2008 Wayne Madsen, a journalist with Online Journal published an article in which he said a research team went to Mombassa, Kenya and located a Certificate registering the live birth of Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. to his father, a Kenyan citizen and his mother, a US citizen.

Berg's argument to the court was that under the US Nationality Act of 1940, Section 317 (b), a minor child follows the naturalization and citizenship status of his or her custodial parent. In Obama's case, Berg argued, a minor child follows the naturalization and citizenship status of his or her custodial father. Obama's Indonesian stepfather, Lolo Soetora signed a statement acknowledging Obama as his son, giving Obama natural Indonesian citizenship, which explains the name "Barry Soetoro" and his citizenship listed as Indonesian. Loss of US citizenship, under US law in effect in 1967 required that foreign citizenship be achieved through "application." Which, according to Berg, is precisely what happened to Obama when his mother married Soetoro and the family moved to Indonesia.

When Obama and his mother moved to Indonesia, Obama had already been enrolled in school—something that could not have happened under Indonesian law if Soetoro had not signed an acknowledgment (the application) affirming that Obama was his son, it deemed his son to be an Indonesian State citizen. (Citizenship of Republic of Indonesia, Law No. 9 of 1992 dated 31 mar. 1992, Indonesia Civil Code): "...State children of Indonesia include: (viii) children who are born outside of legal marriage from foreign State citizen mother who are acknowledged by father who is Indonesian State citizen as his children and that acknowledgment is made prior to children reaching 18 years of age or prior to marriage; Republic of Indonesia Constitution, 1945." Furthermore, under Indonesian law, if a resident Indonesian citizen married a foreigner—in this case, Lolo Soetoro marrying Stanley Ann Obama—she was required to renounce her US citizenship.

In his lawsuit, Berg demanded a copy of Obama's Certificate of Citizenship, a document Obama must have applied for to regain his citizenship—which was lost in Indonesia. He will have that document only if the proper paperwork was filed with the US State Department when Obama returned to Hawaii in 1971 since that is the only way Obama could regain his US "natural born" status. Berg is convinced that Obama was never naturalized in the United States after his return. Obama returned to his maternal grandparents in Hawaii without his mother. Since she is the only one who could have filed for the reinstatement of his citizenship, it is unlikely it ever happened. If it did, his Certificate of Citizenship would affirm his right to seek the office of President. Without it, Barack Obama is just another resident alien who can't legally hold his seat in the US Senate.
 
Now if it is prooven I am wrong about this hey I have no problem with it but the truth does need to come out. Now I do apologize. I did say I was done tonight but I guess I decided otherwise. Oh I will let y'all know if something comes of this.
 
http://www.peeniewallie.com/

Did a Judge Order Obama to Produce his Birth Certificate?

I received an email today from Bud that goes as follows:

JUDGE ORDERS OBAMA TO PRODUCE BIRTH CERTIFICATE

By Jon Christian Dryer

October 3, 2008

NewsWithViews. com

On September 29, 2008 US District Court Judge R. Barclay Surrick, the
federal magistrate for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania ruled in
the matter of Philip J. Berg vs Barack Hussein Obama, et al as the
world was distracted by the $700 billion subprime mortgage crisis.
Obama signed a breathe of relief as the mainstream media chose to
ignore the question:

"Can Senator Barack Hussein Obama legally seek the office of President
of the United States?"

[large portion redacted here - see extended entry to full article]

© 2008 Jon C. Ryter - All Rights Reserved

So, I did some research and the article in question by "Jon Christian Dryer" does not exist on the NewsWithViews.com website. Furthermore, the top of the article lists the author as "Jon Christian Dryer" but the article is signed by "Jon C. Ryter". There is a person named "Jon C. Ryter" that has articles posted on NewsWithViews.com website, but this article is not to be found there.

I checked with Snopes, and they were kind enough to allow as to how Obama is being sued by Philip J. Berg, but they had no specific reference to this particular rumor. Plus, keep in mind that Snopes cannot be trusted as they are clearly in the tank for the Dimocrats. I noticed this some time ago. It would be nice if they were impartial, but they aren't and they can't be trusted when politics are involved.

So, there definitely is a lawsuit filed against Obama by Philip J. Berg over Obama's citizenship and the suit has been moving forward for some time. You can follow the status of the lawsuit against Obama at Citizen Wells.

I found Philip Berg's cell phone number here.

So, I called him on his cell phone and spoke to him for some time. He's a nice guy and he does have a lawsuit against Obama, but the story I saw was a mistake made by someone who saw Philip Berg's response to the jugde and mistakenly believe that the judge had asked Obama to produce his birth certificate. This is not the case.

However, the judge may very well do just that in the next few days. If the judge grants Philip J. Berg the rights of "discovery", then Obama will have to produce a birth certificate.

You can learn more about the suit and follow it at Philip J. Berg's website ObamaCrimes.com.

Hold the phone, folks. This one could get interesting. :)

Continue reading "Did a Judge Order Obama to Produce his Birth Certificate?
 
you make it sound like there is a reasonable belief that his citizenship is in question when in fact that is not the case. Its one man. one man that wants to see it.
 
3mnkids1 said:
you make it sound like there is a reasonable belief that his citizenship is in question when in fact that is not the case. Its one man. one man that wants to see it.
Click to expand...

I'd like to see it or at least want to know why he has a problem releasing the papers.McCain had to proove his citizenship. If I'm wrong about this fine but at least let him release the papers.
 
cin said:
Oh I just couldn't resist answering you ladies wrong his birth certificate is still in question. I 'll post the info tomorrow but it's going to be interesting to see if the judge forces him to release his papers. Really ya'll just can't believe everything you read.

Is the problem that I don't support Obama so I can't have an opinion? I guess that must be it.

JUDGE ORDERS OBAMA TO PRODUCE BIRTH CERTIFICATE

By Jon Christian Dryer

October 3, 2008

NewsWithViews.com

On September 29, 2008 US District Court Judge R. Barclay Surrick, the federal magistrate for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania ruled in the matter of Philip J. Berg vs Barack Hussein Obama, et al as the world was distracted by the $700 billion subprime mortgage crisis. Obama signed a breathe of relief as the mainstream media chose to ignore the question: "Can Senator Barack Hussein Obama legally seek the office of President of the United States?"

The flap began in June when National Review's Jim Geraghty raised the question and asked the Obama Campaign to release a copy of his birth certificate in order to prove that he actually was born in the United States. (Reports had previously surfaced claiming that Obama's Kenyan grandmother, Sarah Hussein Obama, told reporters that Obama was not born in Hawaii, but in Kenya. She reportedly told reporters that when her son, Barack Hussein Obama, Sr. returned to Kenya he was accompanied by a pregnant white wife who was close to term.)

Obama's family did not take to Stanley Ann Dunham Obama well according to Sarah Obama because she was white. Shortly after she arrived in Kenya Stanley Ann decided to return to Hawaii because she did not like how Muslim men treated their wives in Kenya. However, because she was near term the airline would not let her fly until after the birth of her baby. Obama's grandmother said the baby was born in Kenya and that shortly after Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. was born, Stanley Ann returned to Hawaii.

Purportedly, when she arrived back in Hawaii, Stanley Anne registered her son's live birth as an event which had just happened—in Hawaii. This supposition is based on the appearance, shortly after Nov. 6, 2007, of a Hawaiian birth certificate that was issued, as a duplicate birth certificate, by the State of Hawaii to a US Senator who requested it.

While the Internet screamed that the birth certificate, which appeared on the Obama Campaign's "Fight The Smears" website and was also downloaded and used by far left blogger Markos Zuniga on his website, Daily Kos, it was not an electronic image concocted by Daily KOs as was hypothesized by a self-described cyvbersleuth who uses the cyber pseudonym Techdude. It was the real McCoy—even if it was issued as a political favor to a prospective Democratic presidential candidate by a Democrat official in Hawaii. The county clerk who issued the document, which purports to be a copy of an original document, was date stamped "Nov. 6, 2007" on the reverse side of the birth certificate in blue ink which bled through and is visible on the front of the electronic image.

Attorney Philip J. Berg, the former head of the Montgomery County. Pennsylvania Democratic Party and a former member of the Democratic State Convention and, reportedly a Hillary Clinton supporter, wanted to learn the truth from the myriad of rumors that also suggested that Sen. Obama may also have been a citizen of Indonesia. The only consistent part of the story was Stanley Ann returning to Hawaii to claim he had been in the United States and was a US citizen. In his ruling, Judge Surrick noted that the "...cause came before the United States District Court Judge, Honorable R. Barclay Surrick on defendant Barack Hussein Obama and the Democratic National Committee's motion to dismiss." The order continued, "Having reviewed the motion and plaintiff's opposition to said motion and for good cause shown, it is hereby ordered that the motion to dismiss pursuant to F.R.C.P. 12(b)(1) and 12(b)(6) is denied. It is further order of this court that the following discovery is to be turned over to plaintiff within three (3) days.

1. Obama's "vault" version (certified copy of his "original" long version) birth certificate; and
2. a certified copy of Obama's Certificate of Citizenship;
3. a certified copy of Obama's oath of allegiance."

In his original filing, Berg specifically asked for those three items. Berg told the court that "...at the time Plaintiff's complaint was filed, Plaintiff was requesting protections from the court in order to stop Obama from being nominated by the DNC as the Democratic Presidential Nominee as Obama is not eligible to serve as President of the United States. However, Obama was nominated by the DNC...For that reason, Plaintiff must amend his complaint and will be amending this complaint to file a First Amendment complaint...."

Berg argued that he felt it was the role of the Federal Election Commission to ensure that presidential and congressional candidates are eligible to hold the positions for which they were seeking, and that those candidates run a fair and legitimate campaign. "In vetting the presidential candidate," Berg argued, "the DNC and the FEC are required to ensure the eligibility requirements pursuant to our Constitution are met and the Presidential nominee, if elected, is qualified and eligible to serve pursuant to our United States Constitution. In order to be eligible to run for the Office of President of the United States, you must be a "natural born" citizen.

"There appears to be no question that Defendant Obama's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, was a US citizen. It is also undisputed, however, that his father, Barack Obama, Sr., was a citizen of Kenya. Obama's parents, according to divorce recorded, were married on or about February 2, 1961."

"Defendant Obama claims he was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. on August 4, 1961 and it is uncertain in which hospital he claims to have been born. Obama's grandmother on his father's side, his half-brother and half-sister all claim Obama was born not in Hawaii but in Kenya. Reports reflect that Obama's mother traveled to Kenya during her pregnancy; however, she was prevented from boarding a flight from Kenya to Hawaii. at her late stage of pregnancy (which apparently are normal restrictions, to avoid births during flights). By these reports, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama gave birth to Obama in Kenya, after which she flew home and registered Obama's birth. There are records of a "registry of birth" for Obama, on or about August 8, 1961 in the public records office in Hawaii."

Berg's investigators revealed that Obama's own half-sister Maya Soetoro—with whom he was raised—seemed not to know where her own brother was born. In the Nov., 2004 interview by the Rainbow Newsletter Maya Soetoro said Obama was born on Aug. 4, 1961 at Queens Medical Center in Honolulu, Hawaii. In February, 2008 Maya was interviewed by the Star Bulletin. This time she told reporters that Obama was born on August 4, 1961 at the Kaliolani Medical Center for Women and Children. On June 9, 2008 Wayne Madsen, a journalist with Online Journal published an article in which he said a research team went to Mombassa, Kenya and located a Certificate registering the live birth of Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. to his father, a Kenyan citizen and his mother, a US citizen.

Berg's argument to the court was that under the US Nationality Act of 1940, Section 317 (b), a minor child follows the naturalization and citizenship status of his or her custodial parent. In Obama's case, Berg argued, a minor child follows the naturalization and citizenship status of his or her custodial father. Obama's Indonesian stepfather, Lolo Soetora signed a statement acknowledging Obama as his son, giving Obama natural Indonesian citizenship, which explains the name "Barry Soetoro" and his citizenship listed as Indonesian. Loss of US citizenship, under US law in effect in 1967 required that foreign citizenship be achieved through "application." Which, according to Berg, is precisely what happened to Obama when his mother married Soetoro and the family moved to Indonesia.

When Obama and his mother moved to Indonesia, Obama had already been enrolled in school—something that could not have happened under Indonesian law if Soetoro had not signed an acknowledgment (the application) affirming that Obama was his son, it deemed his son to be an Indonesian State citizen. (Citizenship of Republic of Indonesia, Law No. 9 of 1992 dated 31 mar. 1992, Indonesia Civil Code): "...State children of Indonesia include: (viii) children who are born outside of legal marriage from foreign State citizen mother who are acknowledged by father who is Indonesian State citizen as his children and that acknowledgment is made prior to children reaching 18 years of age or prior to marriage; Republic of Indonesia Constitution, 1945." Furthermore, under Indonesian law, if a resident Indonesian citizen married a foreigner—in this case, Lolo Soetoro marrying Stanley Ann Obama—she was required to renounce her US citizenship.

In his lawsuit, Berg demanded a copy of Obama's Certificate of Citizenship, a document Obama must have applied for to regain his citizenship—which was lost in Indonesia. He will have that document only if the proper paperwork was filed with the US State Department when Obama returned to Hawaii in 1971 since that is the only way Obama could regain his US "natural born" status. Berg is convinced that Obama was never naturalized in the United States after his return. Obama returned to his maternal grandparents in Hawaii without his mother. Since she is the only one who could have filed for the reinstatement of his citizenship, it is unlikely it ever happened. If it did, his Certificate of Citizenship would affirm his right to seek the office of President. Without it, Barack Obama is just another resident alien who can't legally hold his seat in the US Senate.
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Really, cin? Because Ken posted the same links a month ago we've been posting :laughing: f a c t check.org and liecount.com
 
3mnkids1 said:
http://www.peeniewallie.com/

Did a Judge Order Obama to Produce his Birth Certificate?

I received an email today from Bud that goes as follows:

JUDGE ORDERS OBAMA TO PRODUCE BIRTH CERTIFICATE

By Jon Christian Dryer

October 3, 2008

NewsWithViews. com

On September 29, 2008 US District Court Judge R. Barclay Surrick, the
federal magistrate for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania ruled in
the matter of Philip J. Berg vs Barack Hussein Obama, et al as the
world was distracted by the $700 billion subprime mortgage crisis.
Obama signed a breathe of relief as the mainstream media chose to
ignore the question:

"Can Senator Barack Hussein Obama legally seek the office of President
of the United States?"

[large portion redacted here - see extended entry to full article]

© 2008 Jon C. Ryter - All Rights Reserved

So, I did some research and the article in question by "Jon Christian Dryer" does not exist on the NewsWithViews.com website. Furthermore, the top of the article lists the author as "Jon Christian Dryer" but the article is signed by "Jon C. Ryter". There is a person named "Jon C. Ryter" that has articles posted on NewsWithViews.com website, but this article is not to be found there.

I checked with Snopes, and they were kind enough to allow as to how Obama is being sued by Philip J. Berg, but they had no specific reference to this particular rumor. Plus, keep in mind that Snopes cannot be trusted as they are clearly in the tank for the Dimocrats. I noticed this some time ago. It would be nice if they were impartial, but they aren't and they can't be trusted when politics are involved.

So, there definitely is a lawsuit filed against Obama by Philip J. Berg over Obama's citizenship and the suit has been moving forward for some time. You can follow the status of the lawsuit against Obama at Citizen Wells.

I found Philip Berg's cell phone number here.

So, I called him on his cell phone and spoke to him for some time. He's a nice guy and he does have a lawsuit against Obama, but the story I saw was a mistake made by someone who saw Philip Berg's response to the jugde and mistakenly believe that the judge had asked Obama to produce his birth certificate. This is not the case.

However, the judge may very well do just that in the next few days. If the judge grants Philip J. Berg the rights of "discovery", then Obama will have to produce a birth certificate.

You can learn more about the suit and follow it at Philip J. Berg's website ObamaCrimes.com.

Hold the phone, folks. This one could get interesting. :)

Continue reading "Did a Judge Order Obama to Produce his Birth Certificate?
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LOL! I went to the site she posted and didn't see anything about what she had posted. I think someone is feeding her the wrong info.
 
cin said:
You bet hold the phones :laughing: Tracey what would we do without you.
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You wouldn't be caught posting untruths if you'd just read what she posts and follow her advice. That's why we posted the f a c t checking sites numerous times. So no one would end up looking foolish.
 
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081010...ngry_crowds;_ylt=ApHxcXVPtssKFyp5Ss8X1qSyFz4D

Raw anger in McCain's crowds as Obama strengthens

LAKEVILLE, Minn. - The anger is getting raw at Republican rallies and John McCain is finally acting to tamp it down.


McCain was booed by his own supporters Friday when, in an abrupt switch from raising questions about Barack Obama's character, he described the Democrat as a "decent person and a person that you do not have to be scared of as president of the United States."

A sense of grievance spilling into rage has gripped some GOP events this week as McCain supporters see his presidential campaign lag against Obama. Some in the audience are making it personal, against the Democrat. Shouts of "traitor," "terrorist," "treason," "liar," and even "off with his head" have rung from the crowd at McCain and Sarah Palin rallies, and gone unchallenged by them.

McCain changed his tone Friday when supporters at a town hall pressed him to be rougher on Obama. A voter said, "The people here in Minnesota want to see a real fight." Another said Obama would lead the U.S. into socialism. Another said he did not want his unborn child raised in a country led by Obama.

"If you want a fight, we will fight," McCain said. "But we will be respectful. I admire Sen. Obama and his accomplishments." When people booed, he cut them off.

"I don't mean that has to reduce your ferocity," he said. "I just mean to say you have to be respectful."

Presidential candidates are accustomed to raucous rallies this close to Election Day and welcome the enthusiasm. But they are also traditionally monitors of sorts from the stage. Part of their job is to leaven proceedings if tempers run ragged and to rein in an out-of-bounds comment from the crowd.

Not so much this week, at GOP rallies in Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Florida and other states.

When a visibly angry McCain supporter in Waukesha, Wis., on Thursday told the candidate "I'm really mad" because of "socialists taking over the country," McCain stoked the sentiment. "I think I got the message," he said. "The gentleman is right." He went on to talk about Democrats in control of Congress.

On Friday, McCain rejected the bait.

"I don't trust Obama," a woman said. "I have read about him. He's an Arab."

McCain shook his head in disagreement, and said:

"No, ma'am. He's a decent, family man, citizen that I just happen to have disagreements with (him) on fundamental issues and that's what this campaign is all about."
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The anti-Obama taunts and jeers are noticeably louder when McCain appears with Palin, a big draw for GOP social conservatives. She accused Obama this week of "palling around with terrorists" because of his past, loose association with a 1960s radical. If less directly, McCain, too, has sought to exploit Obama's Chicago neighborhood ties to William Ayers, while trying simultaneously to steer voters' attention to his plans for the financial crisis.[/QUOTE]


Much more in that article.

John McCain! You just gained a little respect from me in my book! You admitted Obama was a decent man AND a citizen! Please keep telling your extreme, radical, blood-wanting, supporters that!!
 
annielouise said:
Who is Tina Fey? (I don't do politics..)
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If you don't do politics, shouldn't you have asked "Who is Sarah Palin"? :crazytongue:

Would "Liz Lemon" help? Tina Fey plays her on 30 Rock and also plays Gov Palin on SNL. Maybe what you don't do is celebrities, for which I commend you and agree with - in most cases I have no clue who celebrities are.
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Haven't seen SNL since John Belushi was alive, have no idea what 30 Rock is. Read about Sara Palin's BIL tasering a moose on some blog so I know who she is. I get all my news from blog sweeps. Since you have to read them to leave acceptable comments. Just had to do a survey on who was running for governor here, have no idea. But I do think the oil platforms would look nice offshore if they put Christmas lights on them.:) The moose was not on the blog, it was in Alaska.

Edited to add: I am voting for Liz Dehart. Seriously, I am doing a write in vote. If Liz does not mind.
 
Palin abused power, broke no laws in trooper case

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/10/palin.investigation/index.html

ANCHORAGE, Alaska (CNN) -- Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin abused her power as Alaska's governor in the firing of her former public safety commissioner, but violated no laws, a report for the state Legislature concluded Friday.

Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan's refusal to fire Palin's ex-brother-in-law from the state police force was "likely a contributing factor" to Monegan's July dismissal, but Palin had the authority as governor to sack him, the report by former Anchorage prosecutor Stephen Branchflower states.
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She abused her power just like many of us have said. Let this be a warning to the american people that Sarah Palin cannot be trusted and at a moment's notice would most likely abuse her power again to fit her needs. Can't hide form the truth, Sarah!
 
So let me see if I have the facts here. If I don't post something from fact whatever site then I look foolish. And I could never imagine anyone else knows what they are talking about. OK I get it now lol.

You know Obama supporters you want to post things to support your guy great no problem but just realize there are other sites out there and they may contain something you might learn.
 
Sarah Palin must really scare the Obama camp or maybe just the members of this site.

Obama just concerns me because of he is a socialist. And let this be a lesson he can not be trusted but then again can any politician.
 
tharedhead said:
annielouise said:
Who is Tina Fey? (I don't do politics..)
Click to expand...

If you don't do politics, shouldn't you have asked "Who is Sarah Palin"? :crazytongue:

Would "Liz Lemon" help? Tina Fey plays her on 30 Rock and also plays Gov Palin on SNL. Maybe what you don't do is celebrities, for which I commend you and agree with - in most cases I have no clue who celebrities are.
Click to expand...

Haven't seen SNL since John Belushi was alive, have no idea what 30 Rock is. Read about Sara Palin's BIL tasering a moose on some blog so I know who she is. I get all my news from blog sweeps. Since you have to read them to leave acceptable comments. Just had to do a survey on who was running for governor here, have no idea. But I do think the oil platforms would look nice offshore if they put Christmas lights on them.:) The moose was not on the blog, it was in Alaska.

Edited to add: I am voting for Liz Dehart. Seriously, I am doing a write in vote. If Liz does not mind.
Click to expand...

I actually thought Tina Faye was that preachers wife. Oh wait that was Tammy Faye. Really I had no clue who she was until Sarah Palin
 
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